Speaker 1: Two handymen went missing from a 20-acre Weimar
00:00:03
Oregon farm in 2012 and 2013, respectively.
00:00:07
Their whereabouts were unknown until 2014, when detectives
00:00:12
visited the farm and made a gruesome discovery.
00:00:15
Plus, we answer your mail, call questions and Garrett tells us
00:00:19
that throwing food and having sex with inanimate objects is
00:00:22
frowned upon in the state of Florida.
00:00:24
Who would have thought Florida?
00:00:25
I'm Dave Jari, I'm Garrett Corder and this is Criminal as
00:00:31
Fuck.
00:00:32
What's good, everybody, and welcome back to another episode
00:00:44
of Criminal AF.
00:00:44
Once again, I am Dave Jari and with, as always, is my co-host,
00:00:48
garrett Corder.
00:00:49
How we doing.
00:00:51
Hey, I want to give out a huge, huge shout out to Sydney Story,
00:00:56
dylan White, leah McIntosh, dakota Manchette and Matt Bailey
00:01:01
for becoming our newest members of the debauched.
00:01:04
Thank you so much.
00:01:05
Love the support guys debauched .
00:01:06
Speaker 3: Thank you so much Thank you so much.
00:01:07
Speaker 1: Thank you so much.
00:01:08
We'd also like to say hello to all of our new free members on
00:01:11
Patreon as well.
00:01:13
Good to be back, Garrett.
00:01:17
Speaker 4: Dude, I missed you so much, buddy.
00:01:19
Speaker 1: I went on a nice three to four week little
00:01:21
excursion, did a little.
00:01:24
Speaker 4: I went out to Maine.
00:01:25
Speaker 1: Up to Maine.
00:01:26
Speaker 4: Up up up, you had a little bit more history in your
00:01:30
vacation.
00:01:31
Speaker 1: I just sat on the beach all day.
00:01:32
So for the main listeners, you know, for the public listeners,
00:01:39
we've been going for quite a while.
00:01:40
However, I did post some stuff to our Patreon members.
00:01:43
You can get see all that for $5.'s dave's uh historical vlogs
00:01:48
walking around a fucking mass graveyard dude, I did.
00:01:52
It was an hour and a half video for uh manassas, uh, almost a
00:01:57
two-hour movie for antietam and over two two-hour video for
00:02:01
gettysburg.
00:02:02
So it's all on our patreon.
00:02:04
If you want to check it out, if , tell me to go fuck myself.
00:02:06
I don't know, I won't tell you.
00:02:08
Speaker 4: Yeah, you probably walked a good.
00:02:09
You had to have walked a couple miles.
00:02:10
Speaker 1: Oh, I did A lot of walking.
00:02:12
Hell yeah, I did a lot of walking.
00:02:14
Speaker 4: No, I walked four feet to the beach and sat my ass
00:02:17
out down and did absolutely nothing.
00:02:19
That sounds like more of a vacation to me.
00:02:22
Yeah, you know, to each its own For me.
00:02:25
Speaker 1: I was a little bit too long, like I was over it.
00:02:29
Speaker 4: you know I get what you're saying I think everybody
00:02:34
the vacation's fun, you plan it.
00:02:35
You're like, oh, you're all excited, and then, like halfway
00:02:37
through, you're like I just want to go home in my own bed.
00:02:39
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just want my own bed.
00:02:40
That's all I was thinking.
00:02:42
Call it a day.
00:02:42
You know what I mean.
00:02:43
Speaker 6: Yep yeah, when I spent two weeks in Italy, I was
00:02:46
oh, mr World Traveler over here.
00:02:49
Speaker 1: All right, mr Bougie, fucking Italian.
00:02:51
Speaker 4: I'm not trying to flex, oh yeah, oh yeah.
00:02:52
When he was backpacking through the Swiss Alps.
00:02:55
It's like oh I only eat pizza.
00:03:07
It's delicious by the way that now italian, like actual italian
00:03:09
pizza is delicious.
00:03:09
Yeah, okay, at least the one we had.
00:03:10
Yeah, I see I don't buy it.
00:03:11
No, I'm such a shitty american pizza fan.
00:03:12
Speaker 6: It's just so good.
00:03:13
Yes, I'm not gonna.
00:03:15
I mean connecticut.
00:03:16
Yeah, I know we are the pizza capital of the world and I don't
00:03:20
care what anyone says on this podcast.
00:03:21
Speaker 4: I will argue with you to the death that connecticut
00:03:24
has the best pizza the New Haven pizza, the New Haven pizza.
00:03:26
But there's people that will freak out.
00:03:29
Speaker 6: Well, and I do have to take some people to New Haven
00:03:34
.
00:03:34
Speaker 4: Yes.
00:03:34
Speaker 6: And have them try Sally's and Modern you got to do
00:03:37
the gauntlet.
00:03:38
Speaker 4: That's what we call it.
00:03:46
Speaker 1: We call it if anybody wants to come to Connecticut.
00:03:48
You gotta go to New Haven.
00:03:49
Speaker 4: Do the gauntlet, thanks for the invite, by the
00:03:50
way.
00:03:50
Speaker 7: If you haven't had it .
00:03:51
Speaker 6: I've only had fucking what's his Pepe's at the casino
00:03:52
.
00:03:52
That's not even in Canada.
00:03:53
I've never been to New Haven, you get a slice of either cheese
00:03:57
or pepperoni.
00:03:58
Speaker 4: You can't go specialty because you have to
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try the base.
00:04:01
Pepperoni's fine.
00:04:02
Speaker 5: I would say pepperoni ?
00:04:03
Speaker 6: No, it's just true One bite.
00:04:05
Everyone knows the rules.
00:04:06
Speaker 4: It's probably trademarked, so we're screwed
00:04:08
there you go and then try a slice from each place.
00:04:12
Speaker 6: Maybe that needs to be one of our special day trips
00:04:14
that we document Exclusively on the Patreon, exclusively on the
00:04:17
Patreon.
00:04:17
Speaker 4: Exclusively on the.
00:04:18
Speaker 1: Patreon, my, my sons and I.
00:04:20
We went to Philadelphia it was a birthday present given to me
00:04:23
to go tour the Eagle Stadium.
00:04:25
I saw your pic.
00:04:27
We actually did a comparison between D'Alessandro's pizza,
00:04:35
steak and cheese and Chubby's.
00:04:38
Speaker 4: We actually have a video.
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You didn't hit the big two.
00:04:40
I haven't put Geno's and Pat's.
00:04:42
Speaker 1: Dude, that's terrific .
00:04:43
Speaker 4: I know it's terrific.
00:04:44
Speaker 1: I know, I know, and they both suck, but I would have
00:04:47
to say D'Alessandro's is probably my number one, ishka
00:04:51
Bibble's my number two, officially.
00:04:53
Speaker 4: Ishka Bibble.
00:04:53
It's a staple on this podcast.
00:04:55
Now is by Steak and Cheese Grinders.
00:04:56
Yep, you and people who are from Australia.
00:04:58
They're like Sub.
00:05:00
Sorry for the non-New Englanders.
00:05:01
Yeah, it's a grinder.
00:05:05
Speaker 1: But what is this thing?
00:05:06
You said you had something for me, oh.
00:05:08
Speaker 4: I almost forgot.
00:05:09
So our friend Debbie over at True Crime University.
00:05:21
Obviously everybody's heard the ads, everybody, all that stuff.
00:05:23
Oh, here we go.
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Hold on.
00:05:24
Dave's birthday was a while ago .
00:05:26
We all went on vacation so we haven't posted a new episode in
00:05:29
a while, so this will be the first time he actually opens it.
00:05:30
Is it a fucking bomb?
00:05:32
Speaker 6: I don't know where it's from, fucking concrete.
00:05:36
Speaker 1: It went through the Secret Service right.
00:05:37
Definitely a bomb.
00:05:42
Speaker 4: Debbie from True Crime University sent this over
00:05:44
to you as a birthday present.
00:05:46
We might have to clear this out why?
00:05:49
Speaker 1: what is it?
00:05:50
Is it a dildo?
00:05:52
Speaker 4: I don't know, you tell me.
00:05:53
Speaker 2: I'm opening it right now so you wait.
00:05:59
Speaker 1: She sent it to you.
00:06:01
Speaker 4: I will tell you the full story, after we see it,
00:06:03
about the debacle that happened when this showed up to my door.
00:06:07
Speaker 1: What the fuck is it I see?
00:06:10
Oh, I see titties.
00:06:11
Oh my God, oh my God, take it out of the plastic.
00:06:18
Oh my, is it real?
00:06:19
Speaker 4: I don't know.
00:06:20
I thought it was wet when I first opened this Is there
00:06:23
actual holes?
00:06:23
Speaker 1: I can use.
00:06:24
Hold on a minute.
00:06:26
Wait, how do you get it out of the?
00:06:28
Speaker 6: plastic.
00:06:28
He said with absolute seriousness.
00:06:30
Speaker 1: Yeah, is there holes I can use?
00:06:32
Hold on, let me get it out of the plastic.
00:06:35
All right, we're going to show this.
00:06:37
Can we get a close-up?
00:06:39
Speaker 4: You definitely can't show that on.
00:06:41
Youtube.
00:06:42
Hold on wait.
00:06:44
Speaker 1: It's got an asshole too, oh my God, hold on, hold on
00:06:47
, hold on.
00:06:48
Oh yeah, look at it, it sounds real.
00:06:51
Oh my God, oh Debbie with a winner.
00:06:54
Ooh, save too.
00:06:55
You got to blur that out.
00:07:00
It looks disgusting.
00:07:03
Oh my God, that is fucking hilarious.
00:07:05
Look, it's got the little.
00:07:08
Speaker 4: That has to stem from our episode where we just were
00:07:10
ranking Amazon.
00:07:12
They're nice, right.
00:07:13
I feel the tits, let me feel, let me squeeze, I want to
00:07:16
squeeze.
00:07:16
This is hilarious.
00:07:18
Oh, my fingertips.
00:07:20
Speaker 1: It does have a hole my fingers.
00:07:26
Speaker 4: Let me see it my finger.
00:07:27
Look, I didn't open it when, I we're definitely blurring this
00:07:33
out.
00:07:35
Speaker 1: Oh shit, it's heavy yeah dude, I think I just
00:07:38
dropped something.
00:07:39
Speaker 4: Oh, I don't even want to Dude.
00:07:40
By the time this goes home to Dave's house tonight it's going
00:07:43
to be used.
00:07:43
Speaker 1: Dude, that thing is going to be used and fucking
00:07:46
abused great job, debbie.
00:07:47
Speaker 4: By the way, too, that is hilarious here, pass it over
00:07:49
.
00:07:49
I don't know how we're gonna block this one out.
00:07:51
We're gonna keep it right here, you, my girl right there,
00:07:57
imagine doing this, all right, so the story the story of the
00:08:01
story behind this right is when I, when she found out when she
00:08:04
was asked for my address, she sent it.
00:08:07
As to Garrett Corder and my address, it wasn't criminal AF,
00:08:11
it wasn't anything like that.
00:08:12
So my wife opened it, she saw it and she was like what the
00:08:18
fuck did you order?
00:08:19
And I'm like I completely forgot.
00:08:21
I had this conversation with you know, chris from Fright
00:08:25
Flick Maricu, and I completely forgot.
00:08:28
No.
00:08:30
Speaker 1: Oh, chris, oh, I messed up, chris.
00:08:34
Speaker 4: Cheeky no, or Jay Jay .
00:08:38
Why is his name Chris?
00:08:39
On?
00:08:40
Speaker 2: We definitely have to edit that out.
00:08:41
Speaker 4: No, it is Chris.
00:08:42
Yeah his first name is Chris.
00:08:43
Yeah, okay, oh.
00:08:44
Speaker 2: I was going to talk about chicken.
00:08:46
Speaker 4: Okay so you see now I'm fucking up.
00:08:50
So Chris messaged me and said, hey, debbie wants to send
00:08:53
something.
00:08:53
I sent him my address.
00:08:54
So when it came up, kelly looked at it and was like what
00:08:57
the fuck did you order?
00:08:58
And I completely forgot I had the conversation that, oh, I'm
00:09:00
sending something for Dave's birthday.
00:09:02
Make him open it on the next episode.
00:09:04
So I'm like I didn't order anything.
00:09:06
And she's like why the fuck would you order this?
00:09:08
Like that's so weird.
00:09:11
She was generally upset about the fact that I ordered that on
00:09:14
Amazon and I was like no, I had to have been a mistake.
00:09:17
And then when I got home and she didn't even tell me what it
00:09:20
was, she was just mad.
00:09:21
I was like what the fuck did that?
00:09:28
Like what?
00:09:28
What did I order?
00:09:28
I was looking at my amazon history and everything I get
00:09:30
home I see that like, oh, that's gotta be for dave and then I
00:09:31
remembered, oh, but like legit upset of that, she thought that
00:09:33
I ordered she opened it.
00:09:36
She's like you're into this shit .
00:09:37
She opened it.
00:09:38
Yeah, she opened it dude this.
00:09:40
Speaker 1: This can't be cheap.
00:09:41
No, no, no.
00:09:41
This can't be cheap.
00:09:42
Speaker 4: No, no, no no, this can't be cheap.
00:09:44
No, it's got some weight to it for sure.
00:09:46
Speaker 1: Look, did it bounce.
00:09:47
All right, put it somewhere.
00:09:54
All right, put it in the box.
00:09:55
Put it in the box.
00:09:56
What's in?
00:09:57
Speaker 4: the box.
00:09:57
You know what's so funny?
00:09:57
He's like put it somewhere, like he's not going to get home
00:09:59
anymore.
00:10:00
Kid.
00:10:01
Speaker 1: What's in the box?
00:10:01
Okay, what's?
00:10:03
Speaker 4: in the box.
00:10:03
So, yeah, thank you, Debbie, for getting Dave that awesome
00:10:07
gift.
00:10:08
Speaker 1: That is amazing.
00:10:09
Oh my God.
00:10:09
Thank you so much, debbie.
00:10:10
That's fucking awesome.
00:10:13
Yeah, we got to figure out how we're going to put that on
00:10:15
YouTube.
00:10:15
Maybe we can.
00:10:18
Speaker 4: That can be the first .
00:10:18
Oh, get a shelf, get a shelf, we'll put them up there.
00:10:23
We'll put pasties on it, so it's safe.
00:10:25
Speaker 1: We'll put some underwear.
00:10:26
Those are some nice nipples.
00:10:27
We'll figure it out.
00:10:30
Thank you very much, debbie.
00:10:31
Good to be back.
00:10:33
Look at that, we got almost a life-size fucking midget doll.
00:10:38
Oh man, all right, all right, All right, all right, focus in.
00:10:46
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah, focus we're already getting
00:10:47
distracted because you brought out tits and look at us, we're a
00:10:50
mess.
00:10:50
And it has actual holes.
00:10:52
Speaker 2: Oh God, that's so gross.
00:10:53
Speaker 1: That's so gross, all right, so I love how.
00:10:58
Speaker 4: Casey just showed up completely.
00:10:59
Yeah, no, that's not in my realm.
00:11:01
Speaker 1: He's like that's out of my wheelhouse.
00:11:03
Have fun, yeah, with that.
00:11:07
Oh, trust me, I'll send pictures, ew, I'll post them on
00:11:10
the Patreon.
00:11:11
Speaker 4: Yeah, you guys sign up for the Patreon Five dollars.
00:11:13
Dave will post it.
00:11:14
Speaker 6: Our next exclusive Patreon content yes.
00:11:17
Speaker 4: It's going to be Polaroids.
00:11:18
It's stuck.
00:11:20
We'll finally get the Polaroids that Dave promised at 100
00:11:22
subscribers.
00:11:23
Speaker 1: All right.
00:11:25
So there is a short story that I want to share real quick that
00:11:28
Holly Mo shared with us on our WhatsApp chat group.
00:11:32
So it originally came from a Reddit from Herman the Shocker.
00:11:41
I don't know if you've ever heard of him.
00:11:42
Speaker 4: No, I have not heard of him.
00:11:43
Speaker 1: He posts these wild stories or whatever.
00:11:45
Now, I searched high and wide to cross-reference this story
00:11:49
because I'm like, eh, it seems kind of a little fucking wild to
00:11:52
be an actual legit fucking story, other you know, because
00:11:58
it doesn't have really any particular information,
00:12:02
identifying information other than the city and state of where
00:12:06
it comes from.
00:12:07
Right, however, doing the digging that I do do, I did find
00:12:12
a text on archiveorg and it's froma book called sex-related
00:12:17
homicide and death investigation practical and clinical
00:12:20
perspectives.
00:12:21
All right, in this case sounds legit to me yeah, it's actual,
00:12:24
like an actual, like fucking study, I guess.
00:12:26
And this is, uh, a case that's listed in the book as case study
00:12:31
number seven.
00:12:31
So this is in fact a true story , but, as I mentioned, because
00:12:35
it's a case study, there's really no name of the, the
00:12:38
person involved, there's no name of the victim, blah, blah,
00:12:41
right.
00:12:41
Anyways, this event takes place in pontiac michigan.
00:12:44
What a name.
00:12:45
Speaker 4: Yeah, pontiac michigan the home of the I blah,
00:12:47
blah, blah blah.
00:12:47
Anyways, this event takes place in Pontiac, michigan.
00:12:49
What a name, yeah, pontiac.
00:12:49
Speaker 5: Michigan, pontiac.
00:12:50
Speaker 1: The home of the Irox, camaro and trailer parks.
00:12:52
Yeah, let's go All right.
00:12:54
In a police interview a man admitted to having gay
00:12:56
tendencies at the age of seven.
00:12:58
His first gay experience was in a state hospital at the age of
00:13:02
14, when another patient forced him to have anal sex with him oh
00:13:06
Jesus.
00:13:06
He stated that it scared him but he liked it.
00:13:09
He liked that little rimming.
00:13:11
He also stated that he had been committed to the hospital over
00:13:16
his fantasies about killing his neighbor and had begun tape
00:13:19
recording his fantasies.
00:13:22
He spent three years at the state hospital and during his
00:13:24
stay he reported that he constantly had these killing
00:13:25
fantasies.
00:13:25
He spent three years at the state hospital and during his
00:13:25
stay he reported that he constantly had these killing
00:13:27
fantasies, could not get rid of them.
00:13:28
So fast forward a little bit and the subject now has a male
00:13:32
lover whom he has been with for approximately 10 years and they
00:13:36
have a long history of domestic violence.
00:13:38
The subject claimed that he and his lover decided to meet each
00:13:43
other at a motel to carry out their long-planned
00:13:47
murder-suicide.
00:13:48
Now I'm not sure who would be?
00:13:51
willing to attend their own murder-suicide.
00:13:53
Speaker 4: Wasn't there a whole thing about a guy wanting to eat
00:13:54
somebody?
00:13:55
That was a true story too.
00:13:57
Speaker 2: That was a true story and he met up.
00:13:59
Speaker 4: One guy wanted to be eaten.
00:14:00
Speaker 2: The other guy wanted to eat somebody that was a
00:14:01
fetish thing.
00:14:01
Speaker 4: They met on FetLife or somewhere yeah.
00:14:04
Speaker 1: So I can see this completely.
00:14:05
Speaker 4: All right.
00:14:05
Speaker 1: Some crazy people out there.
00:14:06
Okay, now the subject told the police that he wanted to kill
00:14:10
his lover.
00:14:11
For all the years of his bitching about his drinking, you
00:14:14
know, shut your fucking mouth.
00:14:16
I'll drink if I want to.
00:14:17
They're just nips, yeah.
00:14:19
So what?
00:14:20
It's fucking eight in the morning.
00:14:21
He admitted that he tried to strangle him in the past, but he
00:14:25
couldn't go through with it.
00:14:25
Now, on this particular day, they both consumed a few bottles
00:14:28
of wine and had taken some drugs.
00:14:30
The subject suddenly stabbed his lover and left the knife in
00:14:33
the victim's stomach.
00:14:34
The subject then stated that he began to think of the fantasies
00:14:39
he had in the past of cutting up his lover and taking body
00:14:42
parts.
00:14:42
He would often masturbate to these fantasies and think about
00:14:46
playing with the body parts.
00:14:47
He started by sawing off his victim's penis and testicles and
00:14:52
taking them to the bathroom where he washed them.
00:14:54
He kept the penis, but he flushed the testicles down the
00:14:58
toilet because he didn't like the way they looked.
00:15:01
Speaker 3: That's so specific.
00:15:02
Speaker 1: They probably popped out of the fucking nut sack and
00:15:04
he's like, oh, these things are kind of like fucking disgusting.
00:15:09
Speaker 4: We've all seen BME Pain Olympics.
00:15:13
Speaker 7: That's a throwback to any 90s kids watching.
00:15:17
Speaker 1: He then sliced off the victim's ears and put one of
00:15:19
the ears down the victim's throat.
00:15:21
But then he changed his mind.
00:15:22
He wanted it back.
00:15:24
So he cut off the victim's head and took the ear out through
00:15:27
the fucking neck.
00:15:28
The subject then pulled out the victim's intestines and sucked
00:15:33
on them and played with them.
00:15:35
Jesus, this is getting brutal.
00:15:36
Yeah, he also sucked on the severed penis in an attempt to
00:15:41
make it hard.
00:15:41
Oh, now you kind of need blood to make a dick.
00:15:46
Speaker 4: Or you know, a living corpse, but okay.
00:15:48
I can see where he's going in his mind.
00:15:53
Speaker 1: Sucking on the intestines and sucking on a
00:15:56
detached, severed, flaccid penis .
00:15:59
You can see that Garrett.
00:16:01
Speaker 4: Alright, keep going.
00:16:02
You're the one who said you can see where it's going.
00:16:04
Speaker 1: Stop now you made it real.
00:16:05
Okay, all right.
00:16:06
All right, then the subject then cut out the victim's tongue
00:16:10
and armpit.
00:16:11
Okay, why the armpit?
00:16:13
I mean it's pretty fucking specific.
00:16:15
I don't know what do you do it?
00:16:20
Do you cut it like a fucking filet?
00:16:22
I mean, it's kind of like I'm trying to feel my arm right now.
00:16:26
You can cut a hole.
00:16:26
You can cut a hole.
00:16:27
You can cut out a hole, or you can slice it, whatever.
00:16:30
I don't know.
00:16:31
That's a weird.
00:16:32
That's interesting, yeah.
00:16:33
So the subject then took the victim's penis, ears, tongue and
00:16:37
armpit and washed them in the sink to masturbate to the body
00:16:41
parts before placing them in his pants pocket.
00:16:43
When he was arrested, he was found with the body parts still
00:16:48
in his pants.
00:16:48
Wow, he was refusing to let those things go.
00:16:52
Yeah.
00:16:53
So I just wanted to share that with you guys, because when I
00:16:55
first read it, when I first read it I was like there's no
00:16:58
fucking way.
00:16:59
This is real.
00:17:00
There's no way, but it is it's.
00:17:02
Yeah, I just wish there was like more, more details Like who
00:17:05
was it, who was the victim?
00:17:07
Speaker 4: You, know that's a very Like I look everywhere I
00:17:11
never understood the obsession with body parts, so that's
00:17:19
always a strange psyche thing that I can never get past.
00:17:21
Yeah, but with Dahmer, with the how they I like the way they
00:17:24
were shiny.
00:17:24
Yeah, yeah, what would dommer with the how they?
00:17:26
I like the way they they were shiny.
00:17:27
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, like exactly all right.
00:17:28
All right, before we jump into this fun today, uh, we're just
00:17:30
going to go over a few things regarding criminal af.
00:17:32
We're a comedic, informative, true crime ish podcast, heavy on
00:17:36
the ish.
00:17:36
Uh, meaning we'll talk about some true crime, like our main
00:17:39
story in florida man, but we'll also be talking about some
00:17:41
things not related to true crime , like mail call or whatever
00:17:44
rabbit holes our ADHD brains bring us down.
00:17:47
But whatever we talk about, we'll be having some fun while
00:17:49
we do it.
00:17:49
Now, sometimes you find that these stories are particularly
00:17:52
funny and we like to call out these idiots who think they can
00:17:57
get away with murder.
00:17:58
Or maybe it's the police force who fucks up a case.
00:18:00
Whatever, there's humor in it.
00:18:03
There's humor in it.
00:18:03
Of course, if this is your first time joining us, you're
00:18:07
about to experience two guys who have zero filter and fucking
00:18:10
swear a lot.
00:18:11
And, with that being said, we do discuss some pretty horrific
00:18:14
and tragic stories that involve murder, rape, torture.
00:18:20
Okay, okay, and we will not shy away from the most gruesome of
00:18:24
details, regardless of how disgusting they may be, like
00:18:28
sucking on intestines.
00:18:29
Speaker 4: Yeah, or keeping an armpit in your pocket, yeah.
00:18:34
Speaker 1: I wonder if you bring that to a department store to
00:18:36
sample the fucking deodorants.
00:18:38
Speaker 4: I can see it being like a salmon, like a filet of
00:18:40
salmon.
00:18:41
Yeah we could do that too.
00:18:42
Probably be the same texture too.
00:18:44
Speaker 1: Now we understand that Criminal AF is not for
00:18:46
everyone, and that's okay.
00:18:47
We just ask that you at least give it a listen.
00:18:49
If it's not for you, hey, thanks for checking it out.
00:18:52
See ya, but if it is, welcome to the debauchery, now head on
00:19:04
over to criminalasfuckcom for all of your criminal AF needs.
00:19:05
If you're at work and you can't write the word fuck, you can go
00:19:09
to CriminalAFPodcastcom or CriminalAFllc.
00:19:11
They'll take you to the same place, but it's just cooler to
00:19:14
say fuck.
00:19:15
Yeah, for sure, that's how we roll.
00:19:16
Anyway, you can check out all of our episodes, videos, reviews
00:19:21
, send us messages for mail, call and dear deuce bags, as
00:19:23
well as join our Patreon for as little as $2 a month for general
00:19:26
support.
00:19:27
Or you can be paid $5 a month and you can get all the awesome
00:19:30
historic videos that I just fucking posted and you can also
00:19:33
get Dave heavy breathing around Gettysburg and this is where the
00:19:37
first battle happened.
00:19:39
This is the bloody lane.
00:19:40
I did a lot of fucking walking.
00:19:42
Speaker 3: I know, it was just funny.
00:19:44
Speaker 4: You're the one who pointed it out.
00:19:44
I didn't even notice Once you pointed it out.
00:19:46
That's all I could hear.
00:19:47
Speaker 1: Yeah, a lot of breathing and mouth clicking.
00:19:49
That makes a great video, all right.
00:19:51
And now, while you're there visiting Criminal AF, go check
00:19:55
out our merch.
00:19:56
Go get your merch.
00:19:58
Yes, oh yes, we're adding new styles and designs all the time,
00:20:03
so jump into that rabbit hole and peep some of our stuff.
00:20:06
You can also visit our friends over at
00:20:11
WelcomeToTheDebaucherycom, where you can find ourselves Fright
00:20:12
Flick, fmk and True Crime University.
00:20:13
Finally, if there is one thing that we ask of you, is that you
00:20:16
go to Apple Podcasts, spotify, good Pods, and leave us a
00:20:19
five-star rating, a positive review, and click the share
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button.
00:20:22
It costs you absolutely nothing to do.
00:20:32
Speaker 6: It'll help us immensely in spreading the word
00:20:33
that criminal AF is the number one true crime podcast in the
00:20:35
world.
00:20:35
Speaker 4: That's a true statement.
00:20:35
It is a true statement.
00:20:38
Speaker 2: Yep, criminal AF.
00:20:40
We'll be back after this quick break.
00:20:42
Speaker 3: Do you like scary movies?
00:20:44
If your answer is yes, then you need to check out my show,
00:20:47
Fright Flick FMK.
00:20:48
My name is Jay and, along with my co-host, Gentleman Jack, I
00:20:53
watch and discuss horror movies and tell you what I think about
00:20:55
them.
00:20:55
New or old, mainstream or underground, no horror flick is
00:20:59
safe from my warped opinion.
00:21:01
So go check out Fright Flick FMK now.
00:21:03
We are on all major podcast platforms and YouTube Also.
00:21:07
Be sure to follow the show on all major social media sites.
00:21:10
But be warned, we are not your mama's podcast, and this promo
00:21:14
will be the longest amount of time you'll hear me talk without
00:21:17
swearing or cracking an offensive joke.
00:21:19
Now go grab your favorite drink , pull up a chair and give us a
00:21:23
listen.
00:21:24
Speaker 2: Now back to Criminal AF Mail call, mail call.
00:21:29
Speaker 4: Oh, it's so nice having a producer, it is.
00:21:32
It's so nice, god.
00:21:34
Speaker 6: No buttons to push Makes me feel like we're like If
00:21:36
the audience knew what we just went through.
00:21:37
I don't know, wait, no, no, no, no, no, no.
00:21:40
Speaker 4: Listen.
00:21:40
This is a High functioning, high budget podcast.
00:21:44
Absolutely.
00:21:44
We didn't just spend Eight hours trying to Figure out a
00:21:47
fucking audio For no reason, because we still Can't figure
00:21:50
out why.
00:21:50
Speaker 1: We got together at 4.30pm and it's now 9pm 9pm but
00:21:54
they don't need To know that.
00:21:55
Speaker 4: Nope, nope.
00:21:56
All they know is we have people Behind the scenes, are running
00:21:59
around like mice behind us right now Somebody's making me a
00:22:03
steak and asparagus with garlic mash right now.
00:22:06
Speaker 6: Yeah, it certainly looks like a professional studio
00:22:08
in there.
00:22:09
Speaker 1: All right you going to share some of that, because I
00:22:11
got nobody making me that.
00:22:12
Well, what?
00:22:16
Nothing, okay, all right, it's time for mail call, where you
00:22:20
send in your questions and we answer them honestly and
00:22:23
truthfully.
00:22:23
No secrets allowed Could be anything you want to ask.
00:22:26
Of course, you know there's the true crime questions.
00:22:28
But also, you know, is there anything you want to know about
00:22:32
us?
00:22:32
You know Casey's joining us now .
00:22:34
Speaker 4: You can ask Casey some questions too.
00:22:35
Send them on in.
00:22:36
Break the ice, some icebreakers for Casey Moore, for Casey
00:22:39
Moore, yep.
00:22:39
Speaker 1: Oh sorry, I don't know if you want your last name
00:22:41
out there.
00:22:42
Speaker 5: My bad For Casey, sorry.
00:22:45
Speaker 4: Icebreakers for.
00:22:45
Speaker 1: Casey yeah, icebreakers for Casey.
00:22:47
All right, you know, if you want to know our deepest,
00:22:50
darkest secrets, you know some of our hopes and dreams.
00:22:53
Do you like penis in our porn or no penis, oh penis.
00:22:57
Speaker 4: Got it.
00:22:58
It's got a penis.
00:22:58
I don't know what you fucking seven, yeah, throwback Callback.
00:23:04
Speaker 1: What's in the box.
00:23:05
Nothing is off limits Now.
00:23:06
For time purposes, we can only do three or four, so if you
00:23:09
don't hear yours in this episode , it will be coming up, I
00:23:11
promise.
00:23:12
First up we have our good friend Lucy.
00:23:15
Speaker 6: Lucy.
00:23:17
Speaker 1: And she asks would you rather be snowed in or
00:23:21
stranded on a tropical island?
00:23:23
My question is do we have volleyball on a tropical island?
00:23:26
Is there a volleyball?
00:23:28
Speaker 4: It doesn't matter, nobody wants to be.
00:23:29
I've seen Castaway.
00:23:31
Speaker 1: I'm good, it would be lonely.
00:23:33
It would be lonely without Wilson.
00:23:35
Speaker 4: You could also say oh , do I have a fire Stranded,
00:23:37
snowed in?
00:23:38
You know what I mean.
00:23:39
If I have power, I'm fine.
00:23:40
I'm fine, I'm going to take snowed in.
00:23:42
Speaker 1: Wait, you're taking snowed in.
00:23:43
Speaker 4: Yes, I'm taking snowed in For sure.
00:23:47
Well, let's make some parameters here.
00:23:49
Okay, say we don't have power, we're stranded in a car For
00:23:56
snowed in.
00:23:59
Speaker 1: No heat.
00:23:59
Stranded in a car, snowed in Help is weeks away.
00:24:03
Speaker 4: Yes, we don't, we well, you don't know.
00:24:05
All right, the plow could come in an hour, it could come in two
00:24:08
weeks, or you're stranded on a desert, on a deserted island.
00:24:13
It's tropical, though I'm changing my mind at that point
00:24:16
it's pineapples and coconuts.
00:24:18
I have a chance to live.
00:24:19
Yeah, I'm a chance to live.
00:24:24
Yeah, I'm 100% sure.
00:24:25
Speaker 1: But then you know, the worst part is if that
00:24:26
snowplow came Like five minutes after you left and now you're
00:24:29
stuck on a tropical island for the next three years.
00:24:31
Speaker 4: But for a long period of time.
00:24:33
Yeah, I'm probably going to go to a tropical island, Absolutely
00:24:35
.
00:24:37
Speaker 1: Like I said, I've watched Castaway.
00:24:38
I can survive.
00:24:39
Speaker 4: To me, there's no fucking question.
00:24:40
I've watched Castaway, I can survive.
00:24:42
To me, there's no fucking question.
00:24:43
Yep, you'll go crazy before you would die.
00:24:44
You're still wasting your food.
00:24:48
Speaker 6: What about you, casey ?
00:24:50
I can't stand the cold, so I'm almost certainly going to take
00:24:55
the tropical island.
00:24:56
There's fish, hopefully, in the ocean that you can live off of,
00:24:58
or crabs.
00:24:58
Speaker 1: The only question is is there going to be water to
00:25:02
drink?
00:25:03
Speaker 6: Yeah, so that's true.
00:25:06
Speaker 4: When you get thirsty, too, you can drink coconut milk
00:25:09
.
00:25:09
You could easily just melt some snow.
00:25:11
Speaker 6: It's hard to get it out of coconut milk.
00:25:12
Speaker 1: You don't have any fire.
00:25:13
You just hold it in your hand and lick your fucking fingers.
00:25:17
Speaker 4: Just compress it.
00:25:18
I don't know.
00:25:19
I'm not a survivalist.
00:25:21
Come on, we're all going to die in any of these situations
00:25:24
anyway, what does it matter?
00:25:27
We're not Bear Gryllis, guys, come on.
00:25:29
Speaker 6: Yeah, where did your car get stranded?
00:25:31
Because there's a good chance you could just get rescued In
00:25:33
the backwoods of Maine.
00:25:35
Speaker 1: That's very true In the backwoods of Maine.
00:25:37
Speaker 6: Now I'm starting to think thing where the roads
00:25:38
don't get maybe stranded, maybe.
00:25:39
Speaker 4: Yeah, see where this is.
00:25:40
We're gonna go back and forth.
00:25:41
You know like we're gonna come up with a better thing in new
00:25:43
hampshire.
00:25:43
Speaker 1: They shut down the kangamangus highway kangamangus,
00:25:46
you made that up no, it's called the kangamangus, the
00:25:48
kangamangus, that's made up that's made up no, because they
00:25:51
don't plow it in the winter, so they shut it down like the road
00:25:54
is just shut down, but but what so?
00:25:56
Speaker 4: you would get stuck where does kangamangus Highway?
00:25:59
Speaker 1: You've ever been up there.
00:26:00
I go there every weekend To the .
00:26:02
Speaker 7: Kangamangus Highway.
00:26:04
Speaker 4: Look it up, google it .
00:26:05
I'm sure it's real.
00:26:06
Speaker 6: Kangamangus Highway.
00:26:07
I'm fucking with you.
00:26:09
Speaker 1: Anyways, yeah, they shut it down every winter.
00:26:10
They don't even plow it.
00:26:11
I don't care, I'd rather die on the island.
00:26:14
Speaker 4: I'm going island because I'd rather die on the
00:26:17
beach in a tropical setting, in a tropical setting.
00:26:19
Yeah, they're frozen in my car.
00:26:20
I don't care if it's Block Island, I'm fucking sorry.
00:26:25
Speaker 1: Sail away on the Block Island ferry.
00:26:28
All right, All right, that was pretty good actually, Thank you.
00:26:31
Thank you very much, Lucy.
00:26:32
That was actually a thought-provoking question.
00:26:35
Yes, Next up we have Jay from Fright Flick FMK and he wants to
00:26:38
know how do you place the toilet paper on the TP holder?
00:26:41
Do you unroll it from the top or from the underneath?
00:26:46
There's only one answer.
00:26:47
Speaker 4: There's only one correct answer.
00:26:48
Yeah, I'm hoping we're on the same page, because I'm not
00:26:51
pretty sure.
00:26:51
I don't think we actually are.
00:26:53
Speaker 6: But if you look at the patent on the toilet paper
00:26:57
roll, it's over the top.
00:26:58
Yeah, I prefer it the other way .
00:27:03
Speaker 4: Underneath you like it underneath?
00:27:04
Speaker 6: Yeah, really that's crazy, over the top.
00:27:06
Speaker 4: You're a psychopath Over the top and you just pull
00:27:10
underneath.
00:27:10
No, over the top, over the top.
00:27:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, it creates more friction when you have to rip
00:27:16
it off, whereas if you do it under the bottom, it's like you
00:27:19
got it goes.
00:27:20
Speaker 4: That's when you pull it, and then the whole bottom
00:27:22
comes out.
00:27:22
Yeah.
00:27:22
I get what you're saying, though I could see why under the
00:27:28
top would be.
00:27:29
Speaker 6: No, no, I don't, it's just.
00:27:31
To me it's like aesthetically pleasing because it's just I
00:27:34
don't know.
00:27:34
I just feel like it's dangling from the back.
00:27:37
Speaker 1: Yeah, you don't see it rather than tucked nicely
00:27:39
folded, Rather than tucked nicely folded.
00:27:40
Speaker 4: I don't know, I see what he's saying.
00:27:41
Aesthetically it works, but I don't know.
00:27:43
It's just a normal.
00:27:44
Speaker 6: No, over the top, over the top.
00:27:46
That's what we're going with, I guess.
00:27:50
Speaker 1: I'm over the top.
00:27:50
Yeah, you're over the top, all right.
00:27:58
Speaker 6: Thank you very much.
00:27:59
Speaker 1: Jay, that was I up.
00:28:00
We have Debbie from True Crime University, and does this have
00:28:05
anything to do with rubber fuck dolls?
00:28:06
Speaker 4: I was going to say the two guys that were behind
00:28:09
the fucking miniature sex doll, the rubber fuck balls.
00:28:14
Speaker 1: All right, do you guys like amusement parks and if
00:28:17
so, which one is your favorite?
00:28:20
Speaker 4: Oh.
00:28:20
Speaker 1: I like that question.
00:28:21
I love amusement parks.
00:28:22
I know what my favorite is.
00:28:24
Go ahead, share with the class.
00:28:26
Tampa Bush Gardens.
00:28:28
Speaker 4: You've said this before.
00:28:29
Yeah, I've heard you talk about this place.
00:28:30
Speaker 1: It's got the cheetah, I've heard you talk about this
00:28:32
place Meow.
00:28:34
Speaker 4: Meow, tampa.
00:28:36
I need to go there.
00:28:37
Eventually, I have to say Universal Universal there.
00:28:45
Eventually, I I have to say universal universal.
00:28:47
Yeah, orlando, yep, I'm going.
00:28:48
Universal adventure, it's not hollywood studios.
00:28:50
Speaker 6: Okay, velocicoaster is so good, there's so many good
00:28:52
rides there yeah, I don't know if I've gone to enough amusement
00:28:56
parks, but magic kingdom the teacups is.
00:29:01
Speaker 4: So listen do not sleep on Magic Kingdom.
00:29:04
That is still the best day.
00:29:05
Splash Mountain Coming from someone who's not recently.
00:29:09
Speaker 1: No, it's Tiana's.
00:29:11
It's still the same concept, it's just something different.
00:29:14
Speaker 4: It's like updated new animatronics lighting
00:29:17
everything.
00:29:17
Speaker 5: It's.
00:29:18
Speaker 4: Tiana's Bayou Adventure.
00:29:21
Speaker 6: It was.
00:29:21
The other one was deemed what racist or something.
00:29:24
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, there was a couple.
00:29:25
Yeah, there was a couple outdated or sensitive things in
00:29:28
the Like what I don't know who knows we're not going to get.
00:29:32
Speaker 6: We're not going to get.
00:29:32
We're not going to Ask Bob Iger .
00:29:34
Yeah.
00:29:40
Speaker 1: I think that's more of oh, that pelican is fucking
00:29:41
offensive.
00:29:42
It's looking at me fucking weird.
00:29:45
Speaker 4: But I heard the updated ride is really good
00:29:47
though.
00:29:47
They have Mickey's Runaway Railroad.
00:29:50
Have you ever heard about that?
00:29:52
Speaker 1: That's the new one, the train one.
00:29:54
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's really good, but they're using
00:29:58
animatronics and lights that shine on them.
00:30:02
It's really cool, interesting.
00:30:04
Speaker 6: I will say the Everest ride at Animal Kingdom
00:30:07
is pretty awesome.
00:30:08
Speaker 5: Everest is awesome.
00:30:09
Speaker 6: No, if we're talking, just not Disney, because it's
00:30:14
not, it's for children, no, well , you know, I'm going to Epcot,
00:30:20
I still I fucks with Disney Disney's still a great trip.
00:30:23
Speaker 4: I mean it's not as weird as.
00:30:25
Disney adults.
00:30:25
Disney adults are weird.
00:30:26
Like I have kids so I get to say that, but you know they're
00:30:29
like the 40-year-old people that go.
00:30:32
It's different, though You're still.
00:30:35
I'm talking about like 45-year-old women who, like,
00:30:38
have Disney stickers on their car, that wear the matching ears
00:30:42
and like it's Disney's their whole life.
00:30:44
They're like oh, did you know that the color green is peekaboo
00:30:48
green?
00:30:48
They're telling you facts like oh, maybe we can go, I just
00:30:53
Disney.
00:30:53
Adults are the worst.
00:30:54
I don't care what anyone says.
00:30:57
Speaker 6: They're the worst.
00:30:57
Yeah, I think Six Flags sucks.
00:31:00
Speaker 4: I'm not a big Six Flags fan, no Superman's a great
00:31:02
ride.
00:31:03
Speaker 6: It's not my thing.
00:31:03
Speaker 5: Superman is a great ride.
00:31:05
Speaker 6: I would probably go with Universal, yeah, so.
00:31:09
Speaker 4: Islands of Adventure.
00:31:09
Speaker 6: Islands of Adventure it's got a little bit of
00:31:11
everything.
00:31:12
Yeah, you know.
00:31:13
Speaker 4: Hulk is fantastic.
00:31:15
Speaker 1: I like the rides at the Norwich Fair.
00:31:18
Speaker 6: It's been the Norwich Community Fair the carnival
00:31:20
rides that you go on.
00:31:22
Speaker 4: That are there's a half drunk dude fucking behind
00:31:26
there like they put up an entire ferris wheel he's tall enough,
00:31:29
let him on no, I'm going with Tampa Bush.
00:31:33
Gardens, tampa Bush Gardens and I think we're both on the same
00:31:36
page Islands of Adventure.
00:31:38
Didn't they get rid of Jaws?
00:31:41
Where was?
00:31:42
Speaker 6: the Jaws ride.
00:31:43
That was the studio Studios right and then.
00:31:47
Speaker 4: Earthquake.
00:31:47
Remember Earthquake screwed the shit out of me.
00:31:50
Earthquake one was good too, I'm telling you Universal.
00:31:56
Speaker 1: I'm not saying I don't like Universal.
00:31:58
Speaker 6: It's got a little bit of everything.
00:31:59
Speaker 1: Universal does not have a cheater.
00:32:02
Speaker 6: I do wish we were sponsored by them.
00:32:03
You guys should take your family to Universal.
00:32:05
Speaker 4: Yes, yes, yes and send us a check when you do.
00:32:10
Speaker 1: Universal alright thank you so much, debbie, for
00:32:14
your question.
00:32:14
If you guys have questions to send in to us, just let us know.
00:32:18
Send it in.
00:32:18
Go to criminalasfuckcom or criminalafllc and click on the
00:32:23
mail call tab.
00:32:24
What in the?
00:32:26
Speaker 5: fuck is going on in florida let's go to florida good
00:32:42
, go ahead.
00:32:45
Speaker 4: St Petersburg, florida, some of the best cops
00:32:48
episodes ever.
00:32:49
Speaker 6: St Petersburg yeah, During a drunken outburst.
00:32:52
Speaker 4: Friday evening a man threw gator nuggets into a
00:32:56
Florida restaurant and then proceeded to sexually molest a
00:32:58
manatee.
00:32:58
Mannequin Say that five times fast Manatee mannequin In front
00:33:03
of staff and patrons of the establishment.
00:33:05
According to the smoking gun, Investigators say Anthony
00:33:12
Michael Lessa, 23, was intoxicated when he caused a
00:33:16
disturbance at Rick's Reef.
00:33:18
Welcome to Rick's Reef, a seafood joint in St Petersburg.
00:33:21
Welcome to Rex Rave, a seafood joint in St Petersburg.
00:33:23
Lessa cops say was throwing gator nuggets found in his right
00:33:25
pants pocket upon arrest into the restaurant.
00:33:29
What are gator?
00:33:30
Oh, what are gator nuggets?
00:33:33
They're exactly like chicken nuggets, but with alligator meat
00:33:36
.
00:33:36
Have you never had alligator?
00:33:37
I've had alligator.
00:33:39
Oh, dude, alligator's great.
00:33:40
I've never had gator nuggets.
00:33:41
It's like the consistency of chicken or the consistency of
00:33:45
calamari, but it tastes like chicken.
00:33:47
Speaker 1: That's the best way to explain it I've had gator
00:33:51
jerky.
00:33:52
Speaker 4: Oh, yeah, yeah, I'm talking about like a fresh tail,
00:33:54
or nuggets in that instance.
00:33:57
Speaker 5: Gator nuggets.
00:33:57
Speaker 4: When employees confronted Lessa about flinging
00:34:01
the nuggets, he became belligerent and advanced on the
00:34:03
life-size mannequin Manatee.
00:34:05
Show the mannequin Casey what does the mannequin look like.
00:34:13
Speaker 1: Oh, look at him.
00:34:15
Speaker 4: He's just minding his own business Of onlookers.
00:34:18
Lessa then went on to sexually molest the mannequin which had
00:34:23
been known to wear a t-shirt promoting their scrumptious
00:34:29
tacos.
00:34:30
After running from the eatery, lessa cop's charge caused a
00:34:36
disturbance at a nearby hotel, where he yelled and cursed at
00:34:38
the front desk worker and stood in the parking lot yelling
00:34:41
obscenities.
00:34:41
I wanna fuck humanity.
00:34:43
When police arrived at the scene, lessa exhibited multiple
00:34:47
signs of intoxication and kept asking why he was being arrested
00:34:50
.
00:34:50
I don't know, dude, because you raped a manatee through gator
00:34:54
nuggets at people.
00:34:56
Speaker 6: Do you?
00:34:57
Speaker 4: have the police report.
00:34:58
Speaker 6: I do.
00:34:58
I'm actually curious yeah.
00:35:02
Speaker 1: Is that the charging document?
00:35:04
Speaker 4: Yeah, he was charged with disorderly intoxication
00:35:07
disturbance.
00:35:07
Lessa was booked into jail on the misdemeanor count.
00:35:12
He was released from custody on Saturday morning.
00:35:15
According to LinkedIn page, lessa is a student pilot who is
00:35:18
attending a flight school in Ponte Verde.
00:35:21
Pilot who's attending a flight school in ponte verde.
00:35:25
Lesa, who attended west virginia university, gave his
00:35:26
home address as his family's pittsburgh, pennsylvania
00:35:28
residence.
00:35:28
Oh, interesting, interesting.
00:35:31
Now we always joke about like oh, that's the most florida
00:35:36
thing ever but yeah this.
00:35:38
This is up there because it's got gator tail, g, gator nuggets
00:35:42
.
00:35:42
Speaker 1: Gator nuggets.
00:35:44
Speaker 4: It's a Florida Napoleon Dynamite.
00:35:45
He's keeping gator nuggets in his pockets.
00:35:49
Speaker 1: Anybody want a nugget ?
00:35:50
Speaker 4: You got any.
00:35:51
Tots Gator tots and a manatee.
00:35:54
What's more Florida than manatees?
00:35:55
Speaker 1: Who gets sexually assaulted?
00:35:57
Speaker 4: And then being belligerently drunk in public.
00:35:59
Speaker 1: It's just got all the good things.
00:36:01
It's got one two belligerently drunk in public.
00:36:02
It's just got all the good things.
00:36:01
It's got one, two yeah.
00:36:03
Speaker 4: It's got all the good things.
00:36:03
Nobody got hurt either.
00:36:06
Speaker 6: So it's like you know , Except for the manatee, poor
00:36:08
thing, Everybody should go down to a float over to Cryer.
00:36:11
Oh dude, that's my.
00:36:15
Speaker 4: Where is this?
00:36:15
St Petersburg.
00:36:16
I feel like I can move there.
00:36:17
Speaker 1: I wonder if that manatee's still sitting outside.
00:36:20
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, Now it's going to be a staple.
00:36:21
Speaker 6: Yeah.
00:36:22
Speaker 4: Yeah.
00:36:23
Speaker 6: People are going to go up to it taking pictures.
00:36:25
They're not even going to know what happened to it, right, you
00:36:27
know, poor thing.
00:36:29
Speaker 2: Yep, he's going to have fucking flashbacks,
00:36:36
criminal.
00:36:36
Speaker 5: AF.
00:36:36
We'll be back after this quick break.
00:36:37
So you like to listen to people talk about crime, but did you
00:36:41
ever wonder why criminals do the things they do, like what makes
00:36:45
them tick?
00:36:46
My name is Debbie and I'm the professor at True Crime
00:36:49
University.
00:36:50
Join me in the classroom Thursdays, wherever you get your
00:36:58
podcasts for intellectual discussions about crime,
00:36:59
psychology and why criminals do what they do.
00:37:01
See you there.
00:37:04
Speaker 2: Now back to Criminal AF.
00:37:08
Speaker 1: All right, that was kind of fucked up.
00:37:09
All right, we're going to jump right into this story about two
00:37:11
handymen who went missing from a 20-acre farm in Weimer, Oregon,
00:37:15
one in 2012 and the other in 2013.
00:37:18
In 2014, detectives following up on an identity fraud case
00:37:23
made a horrific discovery.
00:37:25
Garrett Now, I'm just going to put this out there.
00:37:27
We're going to tell this story as it's told through the media
00:37:30
outlets, through court documents and police records, just like
00:37:34
we do with any other story.
00:37:35
I'm just going to leave it at that.
00:37:38
Okay, Some foreshadowing here Some foreshadowing Put your
00:37:45
earbuds in, in pour yourself a favorite drink.
00:37:46
Yep, there you go and tell your kids that summer vacation is to
00:37:52
be spent outside.
00:37:53
So get the fuck out of the house, because time to fuck this
00:37:57
episode in the mouth.
00:37:58
What do you say?
00:37:58
Ready for this?
00:37:59
Let's, let's go, let's do it.
00:38:00
Alright Now?
00:38:02
This story begins on July 8th 1948, when Susan Monica was born
00:38:07
as Stephen Buchanan in San Francisco, california.
00:38:13
Speaker 4: What a great way to start the story, alright.
00:38:16
Speaker 1: Little is known about her life growing up, but we
00:38:19
know she had a brother and a sister.
00:38:21
She explained during her police interview that her sister had
00:38:25
down syndrome and her mother couldn't handle having a child
00:38:28
with a disability, so her sister was placed in a foster home in
00:38:30
santa rosa.
00:38:31
What a pussy.
00:38:32
Yep, especially downs like come on, I know like that like it's
00:38:38
not really a thing, you know.
00:38:39
I mean it's not like, I mean whatever.
00:38:40
Yeah, there's a lot.
00:38:43
Speaker 4: There's a lot worse it could be harder.
00:38:44
Speaker 7: It could be harder.
00:38:45
Speaker 1: All right Now.
00:38:46
Susan said that she had been told that her sister had died
00:38:49
and she was estranged from her brother.
00:38:51
She said that the last time she had heard he was living in
00:38:54
South Dakota.
00:38:55
What this says to me is that Susan Monica did not have a
00:38:59
healthy childhood growing up.
00:39:01
Probably that Susan Monica did not have a healthy childhood
00:39:05
growing up?
00:39:05
Probably not.
00:39:05
She did not form any familial bonds with her siblings or
00:39:06
parents and was possibly physically and emotionally
00:39:07
abused in her childhood.
00:39:07
Speaker 4: I mean to be fair.
00:39:08
Has any story that took place in the 40s or 50s that we've
00:39:11
told on this podcast?
00:39:12
Nobody had a good childhood back then.
00:39:14
Yeah, it was rough, I feel like everybody had a bad childhood
00:39:18
in the 40s.
00:39:20
Speaker 1: Why aren't you in bed at 7 pm?
00:39:22
Whack.
00:39:24
Speaker 4: Where's?
00:39:24
Speaker 1: my drink, shh.
00:39:26
Your father just came home from work.
00:39:27
Sit down, nobody talk, everybody be quiet.
00:39:29
Imagine All right.
00:39:31
So now, but you know this is all speculation, I'm just
00:39:34
throwing this out there, you know, and, as we've said, there
00:39:36
wasn't much information of her upbringing.
00:39:38
But this speculation is consistent to, as we said, other
00:39:42
cases that we've covered.
00:39:43
Now Susan, still known as Stephen Buchanan, at the time
00:39:48
enlisted in the United States Navy during the Vietnam War.
00:39:51
Speaker 4: Uh-oh, another Vietnam, another Vietnam vet.
00:39:53
We got a history here.
00:39:54
Speaker 1: She was honorably discharged from the Navy after
00:39:57
completing her service and shortly thereafter Susan Monica
00:40:00
began living her life as a woman .
00:40:01
She worked her way to becoming a very successful engineering
00:40:05
career.
00:40:06
Uh, before buying the 20 acre farm in weimer, oregon in 1991
00:40:12
hey, my birth year?
00:40:12
Yep, where your birth year shut the fuck up.
00:40:17
Uh, where she raised pigs, chickens and ran her wrought
00:40:21
iron fence and gate business called White Queen Construction.
00:40:24
That's so funny.
00:40:26
Speaker 4: Garrett, why are you laughing?
00:40:27
Nothing, it's just the fact that White Queen Construction is
00:40:32
just funny to me because, knowing his pet or her pet, yeah
00:40:36
, you know what I'm trying to say yeah, yeah, yeah, sorry, go
00:40:38
ahead.
00:40:38
Speaker 6: Would you hire somebody from White Queen
00:40:40
Construction If you needed your living room painted or an
00:40:45
addition.
00:40:45
Speaker 4: No, if I needed an iron fence or a gate.
00:40:48
Speaker 1: Or some chicken eggs.
00:40:49
If I need some eggs or some bacon, I'd probably call White
00:40:53
Queen.
00:40:54
Speaker 5: Farms.
00:40:56
Speaker 1: When Susan first bought her property, it was
00:40:59
totally undeveloped, so it was all full of trees, nothing
00:41:01
really going on.
00:41:02
Her property.
00:41:02
It was totally undeveloped, so it was all full of trees,
00:41:05
nothing really going on.
00:41:06
It didn't take her long to build a large barn on the
00:41:09
property for her farm animals to live in.
00:41:11
By mid-2013, she started work on building a house.
00:41:16
Susan had placed an ad online looking for a handyman to help
00:41:18
in the construction of the home.
00:41:18
A 56-year-old man named Robert Haney had answered the ad that
00:41:21
Susan had put out to hire.
00:41:23
Now, to Robert, susan, monica seemed like a legitimate
00:41:26
employer and he had been looking for an excuse to live a simple
00:41:29
life.
00:41:30
He was doing various other jobs , including carpentry, manual
00:41:33
labor, repairs, etc.
00:41:34
Basically, he did whatever she asked for.
00:41:38
Now he and his dog.
00:41:41
They lived in a small trailer on the property and, according
00:41:44
to Robert Haney's son, jesse, robert and Susan had a deal
00:41:48
where he would get to stay on the property and be paid cash
00:41:51
and help Susan build the house from the ground up Apparently he
00:41:54
was a great builder, you know very good with his hands.
00:42:00
Now, by December 2013, robert Haney's family realized that
00:42:04
they hadn't heard from him in well over two months.
00:42:07
Well, you know, I've been trying to get a hold of my
00:42:09
father.
00:42:10
What the hell is he.
00:42:12
Speaker 4: He's living in a trailer on somebody's farm.
00:42:13
Speaker 1: Now, obviously, this was concerning and ended up
00:42:18
prompting a visit to Susan's farm.
00:42:20
When they arrived on January 1st 2014, susan had told him
00:42:24
that Robert had just basically left and he had asked Susan to
00:42:28
look after the dog and gave her some cash.
00:42:31
He's like you know what.
00:42:32
Maybe this farm life isn't for me.
00:42:34
Keep my dog.
00:42:35
Here's some cash.
00:42:36
I'm out of here.
00:42:37
All right, that's a couple red flags right there.
00:42:40
Yeah, and she assumed it was because he had been upset upset
00:42:43
over learning about a close family member's assault.
00:42:46
Apparently.
00:42:47
This put him into quite a spiral mentally and his drinking
00:42:50
got quite heavy and he was extremely upset.
00:42:52
So he was up and left.
00:42:54
Now at this point Monica had asked Robert's children to get
00:42:57
his stuff out of the trailer that was on the property.
00:42:59
He doesn't work for me anymore, get his shit out of here, fuck
00:43:04
him.
00:43:04
Now, as they went through the trailer they could see almost
00:43:05
immediately that things were not right.
00:43:07
Things were not seen.
00:43:09
You know it wasn't as fucked up of a trailer.
00:43:13
Living, you know, on a farm, you know where you would think
00:43:18
like a trailer would be all fucked up.
00:43:20
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I'm thinking like a run down
00:43:23
Winnebago.
00:43:23
Right yeah, up on blocks, no tires, yep Kind of thing,
00:43:28
overgrown bushes and a car without a motor.
00:43:31
Speaker 1: You know, typical Florida mansion.
00:43:33
Yeah, the dog chain bolted right to the fucking side of the
00:43:35
trailer.
00:43:36
Yeah, all right, there's some really big red flags for them
00:43:39
with regards to all of Robert's tools.
00:43:41
They were still there, strewn all over.
00:43:44
Speaker 4: Yeah, you're going to leave the dog, but you're going
00:43:46
to knock it, you're going to take the tools Right.
00:43:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, fuck, nevermind .
00:43:49
Uh, they had explained that there's no way their dad would
00:43:53
leave without his tools.
00:43:54
Yeah Right, it was like an extension of him.
00:43:57
Yeah yeah, he would take very good care of these tools.
00:44:00
They were like his livelihood.
00:44:02
Fuck the dog, I'm keeping the tools, I'm keeping the tools,
00:44:06
all right.
00:44:08
So they also saw his favorite leather jacket.
00:44:10
Everybody's got a favorite leather jacket In case you got
00:44:14
one right Favorite leather jacket Sure.
00:44:17
Speaker 4: I mean in Oregon maybe, yeah, in your trailer, in
00:44:20
your backyard, in my trailer.
00:44:22
Speaker 1: Hanging right off the tape.
00:44:23
Yeah, all right.
00:44:24
It was at this point that they decided to talk to the Jackson
00:44:30
County Sheriff's Office to report their dad missing.
00:44:31
Soon they learned that it had actually been months since
00:44:34
anyone had seen Robert Haney, and since he paid for everything
00:44:38
in cash, it was extremely difficult to tell where he had
00:44:40
gone and what he was doing.
00:44:41
Speaker 4: That everything in cash.
00:44:42
It was extremely difficult to tell where he had gone and what
00:44:44
he was doing.
00:44:44
That's pretty hard to do in 2013.
00:44:45
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is Be off the grid like that.
00:44:47
Yeah, now, of course, the sheriff's office asked whether
00:44:49
or not Robert had any bank cards or credit cards, which he did
00:44:52
not, but he did have an Oregon Trail electronic benefits
00:44:56
transfer card that he used to collect his benefits.
00:45:00
Speaker 4: You know, social Security whatever they call it,
00:45:02
the Oregon electronic benefits transfer card.
00:45:07
Speaker 5: Yeah, oh, that's funny.
00:45:09
Speaker 1: Join the dysentery credit union.
00:45:11
I was going to say, like what it's right down the road from
00:45:15
the Donner Party fucking buffet.
00:45:16
It was found that you died for dysentery.
00:45:21
Speaker 5: You can't collect your benefits anymore.
00:45:23
Sorry, go ahead All right.
00:45:28
Speaker 1: It was found that his electronic benefit transfer
00:45:31
card was used in December of 2013 at a nearby Walmart, months
00:45:35
after he allegedly left Susan Monica's property.
00:45:38
Monica's property.
00:45:47
Speaker 4: Now the electronic benefit transfer card.
00:45:48
Speaker 1: Just kind of explain it is electronic, you have to
00:45:49
say it right, it's the oregon trail, the oregon trail the
00:45:52
oregon trail electronic benefit transfer card is an electronic
00:45:55
system that allows state welfare department to issue benefits of
00:45:59
via magnetically encoded payment card which can be used
00:46:08
wherever in the United States.
00:46:09
Speaker 4: Gotcha.
00:46:09
Speaker 1: If that made sense.
00:46:10
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm with you, sounds sophisticated.
00:46:12
Speaker 1: Yeah, I can't read my own writing.
00:46:13
Alright.
00:46:14
So it was at this point that detectives took a drive out to
00:46:16
Susan Monica's property to ask her about Robert's disappearance
00:46:20
.
00:46:20
They said when they arrived there was something out of the
00:46:25
Twilight Zone.
00:46:25
There was vehicles like shitty makeshift structures, garbage
00:46:31
thrown everywhere, basically the property of a hoarder.
00:46:36
Speaker 4: That's in my mind, that's where I was thinking that
00:46:38
.
00:46:39
Speaker 1: Right If you see pictures of Susan and Monica in
00:46:44
the interrogation.
00:46:45
Fucking disgusting.
00:46:48
Speaker 4: She's got a dirty muumuu on.
00:46:49
Speaker 1: Yeah, like nasty shit , stained fucking clothes A
00:46:55
dirty version of the mom from Babe.
00:46:58
Speaker 4: That's what I'm picturing in my head.
00:46:59
That's what I'm picturing in my head.
00:47:01
Speaker 1: Yeah, and she actually admits in the in the
00:47:03
video in the interrogation uh, because they had her sitting in
00:47:06
there for so long.
00:47:07
She's like I shit my pants and they didn't do anything.
00:47:14
They didn't like have her go to the bathroom, she just sat
00:47:16
there in her fucking shit.
00:47:18
Speaker 4: Jesus, we gotta find those somewhere we're trying to
00:47:20
interrogate.
00:47:20
Yeah, that Roman smells.
00:47:23
Oh, I didn't even think of that , yeah it's fucking disgusting.
00:47:27
And they have to act that like play that good cop, bad cop
00:47:30
thing that they do.
00:47:30
You know what I mean.
00:47:32
Speaker 1: I would let you go wipe your ass.
00:47:33
Speaker 4: However, this guy You're sitting there, you ain't
00:47:37
moving.
00:47:37
He has to know the truth.
00:47:39
Speaker 1: Yeah.
00:47:41
Speaker 7: You might switch any spots.
00:47:43
Speaker 4: Can I switch his spots?
00:47:44
Sometimes the lighting in here gets weird on me.
00:47:49
Speaker 7: Is the camera on the wrong end here?
00:47:50
That was shit.
00:47:54
You don't want the sandwich, not at the moment, all right,
00:48:01
and I don't want my pants either , but since I shit in my pants,
00:48:07
without being able to wipe my ass here, so um so I'll kind of
00:48:14
skip you.
00:48:14
Speaker 4: Is it okay if I skip over something?
00:48:19
Speaker 2: Criminal AF.
00:48:19
We'll be back after this quick break.
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episode description.
00:49:55
Speaker 4: Go get you some mouse .
00:49:56
Yes, sir.
00:49:59
Speaker 2: Now back to Criminal AF.
00:50:01
Speaker 1: All right.
00:50:02
So Susan Monica had told detectives that Robert had lived
00:50:05
and worked on her property for about six months, but in the
00:50:08
fall he took a turn for the worst after receiving a phone
00:50:12
call about his family member's assault.
00:50:13
When detectives reviewed security camera footage, they
00:50:17
saw Susan Monica using Robert's EBT card his Oregon Trails
00:50:22
electronic fucking card at the Walmart that was about 25 minute
00:50:27
drive from Monica's property.
00:50:28
Now, law enforcement then executed a search warrant on the
00:50:31
property.
00:50:31
They were taken aback by the sheer squalor of the property.
00:50:35
There was piles of garbage, rotting food and industrial
00:50:39
waste.
00:50:39
They also complained of a very strong smell of decay.
00:50:43
Hmm, wonder where that was coming from.
00:50:46
Speaker 4: I mean it'd be hard to pinpoint anything when the
00:50:49
decay was coming from.
00:50:51
Speaker 1: Yeah, in a hoarder's house Probably from the crotch
00:50:54
Ugh as they were executing the search warrant, they were
00:50:58
filming and one of the officers said to the detective in charge
00:51:01
I think we found something.
00:51:03
The investigator spotted a human leg in the catchment pond
00:51:10
and it was clear to them that it was not an animal bone.
00:51:13
It appeared to be a human leg, as we just said, that had been
00:51:17
severed mid-femur down to the toes.
00:51:20
So what do you think they'd do?
00:51:25
Speaker 4: They bring the mom from Babe down to the sheriff's
00:51:29
station.
00:51:30
Speaker 1: Yeah, they bring the mom from Babe down to the
00:51:32
sheriff's station for questioning.
00:51:34
Speaker 4: That'll do pig.
00:51:35
Sorry, I don't know why I'm doing Babe references right now.
00:51:39
Speaker 6: Did you watch?
00:51:39
Speaker 1: that movie recently I know You're all about Babe
00:51:42
references Sorry go ahead.
00:51:43
Speaker 4: That's what I'm picturing right now.
00:51:45
Speaker 1: Alright.
00:51:46
So they bring her down to the station of questioning and once
00:51:49
she is confronted with the discovery of the human leg on
00:51:51
her property, she begins spinning her story.
00:51:53
She told detectives that one day in the fall she saw her pigs
00:51:57
in a feeding frenzy, and when she went to go check out what it
00:52:01
was, she saw robert laying there with his guts all over the
00:52:04
place.
00:52:05
He was being eaten alive, uh, by the pigs, uh.
00:52:09
She then went on to say that she couldn't stand seeing him
00:52:12
suffer.
00:52:12
So she went and got her gun, holy shit, shot him, uh, just
00:52:17
like she would with any other suffering animal on her property
00:52:20
.
00:52:20
She then left robert's body in the pig pen until a couple days
00:52:23
later when she scooped up his remains and put them in a
00:52:26
garbage bag.
00:52:27
Dude, that's hardcore, oh yeah.
00:52:28
She claimed that a coyote or something must have gotten into
00:52:32
one of the bags and dragged the foot out to the pond Plausible.
00:52:38
Speaker 4: Could happen?
00:52:38
What in the backcountry east bumfuck shit is going on?
00:52:45
Speaker 1: That country eats bumfuck shit, all right.
00:52:47
So when asked why she wouldn't call authorities, susan
00:52:50
explained that she was worried that authorities would want her
00:52:53
to kill her pigs.
00:52:54
God forbid, don't kill her pigs .
00:52:56
The investigators then asked what else they might find on the
00:53:00
property, and it was then that she broke down and said that
00:53:04
they may find something way worse.
00:53:06
Oh, she took a pen and a paper and drew them a map of the
00:53:10
property and put an x on the part of uh in the middle of the
00:53:13
map.
00:53:13
She then told them right here, that's where you're going to
00:53:18
find steve.
00:53:19
Hmm, steve or steven delac was another former handyman of
00:53:27
Monica's who worked on her property in the summer of 2012,
00:53:31
a full year before Robert Haney arrived.
00:53:34
Now, monica had an explanation, of course, of why D'Alessino's
00:53:38
body was buried on her property.
00:53:39
I'm curious.
00:53:40
We're about to find out.
00:53:42
So, according to Susan Monica whileica, while delacino was
00:53:45
working for her, she noticed that the two of her guns were
00:53:48
missing.
00:53:48
Oh, who the fuck took my guns?
00:53:50
They had to dig through all the fucking pigsty and the trash on
00:53:54
the ground.
00:53:55
Just fucking dig out my guns.
00:53:56
I'm fucking pissed.
00:53:57
Uh, she looked through his property and found them among
00:54:00
delacino's things, but when she confronted him about it they got
00:54:04
to to sort of a wrestling match .
00:54:06
You want to wrestle?
00:54:08
I'll wrestle you if I damn guns Ting, that was chewing tobacco.
00:54:15
Speaker 4: Yeah, I picked it up.
00:54:17
I picked it up, I got it immediately oh thank you, I'm an
00:54:20
avid tobacco chewer.
00:54:22
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I know.
00:54:23
Yeah, Susan had said that when they were having a physical
00:54:27
altercation, Stephen got an erection.
00:54:30
No, just kidding, Stephen had grabbed one of her breast
00:54:34
implants.
00:54:34
Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
00:54:37
Speaker 4: What she lives on a farm.
00:54:40
Yes, how does she have breast implants?
00:54:42
She's in rural Oregon living on a farm.
00:54:47
Speaker 1: She was a successful engineer.
00:54:48
She's able to buy a 20-acre farm Well now you just messed up
00:54:52
my whole babe.
00:54:54
Speaker 4: Why the mom from Babe she?
00:54:56
Speaker 2: doesn't have breast implants.
00:54:57
No.
00:54:57
Speaker 4: I don't know she could.
00:54:58
I need to see a picture.
00:55:01
Speaker 1: Yeah, Casey.
00:55:01
Can you pull up a picture of Susan Monica Sure Dave All uh,
00:55:07
yeah, casey can you?
00:55:07
Pull up a picture of susan monica.
00:55:08
Sure dave all right, so yeah, that's her right there, yeah
00:55:10
fucking train wreck right with some fat fake tits.
00:55:13
Speaker 4: Yeah, with no big old titties all right, all right.
00:55:16
Speaker 1: So all right, here we go.
00:55:17
All right.
00:55:18
So susan had said that when he got into having their physical
00:55:21
altercation, uh, steven had grabbed one of her breast
00:55:24
implants and twisted it so bad that she felt like it ruptured.
00:55:28
She complained that she, of course, had to defend herself
00:55:33
after spending $9 on something and having it almost
00:55:37
destroyed.
00:55:38
Speaker 4: A A fair assessment yeah.
00:55:43
There Everybody's entitled to yeah to their property.
00:55:46
It depends on the state.
00:55:48
You know there's some weird laws, but we might be fine.
00:55:51
Speaker 1: Like if you're going to burst one of my fucking
00:55:53
titties.
00:55:53
Speaker 4: Yeah, I spent nine grand.
00:55:54
Speaker 1: That's a felony.
00:55:55
Speaker 4: And what's over a felony?
00:55:55
500 over a felony?
00:55:57
Yeah, I'm fucking murdering your ass.
00:55:59
Speaker 1: Fuck you, All right.
00:56:07
So at some point during the altercation she claimed that one
00:56:08
of the guns went off and struck D'Alessino in the back of his
00:56:10
head.
00:56:10
Now Monica said that at one point during the struggle she
00:56:12
had grabbed another rifle and, standing over D'Alessino, shot
00:56:14
him dead.
00:56:14
Damn, Fuck you, motherfucker.
00:56:17
That's for my tit All right.
00:56:21
After admitted to at least two unreported killings on her
00:56:24
property, Detective Eric Henderson asked Susan if there
00:56:27
were any other dead bodies on her property that they might
00:56:30
encounter.
00:56:31
Detective Henderson said she told me that if she had
00:56:35
mentioned anything about the other 17 others, that she would
00:56:39
spend the rest of her life 17?
00:56:41
17.
00:56:41
I don't know if this is a joke or what.
00:56:44
Yeah, but hey how about it?
00:56:46
Speaker 4: I keep like listening to the story of her like
00:56:49
wrestling these individuals and stuff like that.
00:56:51
Speaker 5: It's like how did she do this right?
00:56:53
Speaker 4: I keep forgetting that she transitioned.
00:56:54
I keep forgetting that like yeah, because she's like oh, I
00:56:59
was wrestling this guy, I wrestled that guy.
00:57:01
She's a, she's a, she's a what and Mark.
00:57:06
Speaker 6: She's a man.
00:57:11
Speaker 1: She's a what Garrett.
00:57:12
Speaker 4: She's a man Originally Biologically,
00:57:15
biologically.
00:57:16
Yes, I don't want to get cancelled.
00:57:20
Speaker 6: I mean the first issue with who.
00:57:23
Was it, steven?
00:57:24
The first one was, chronologically the first issue
00:57:25
with who was it Stephen?
00:57:26
Speaker 1: The first one was.
00:57:27
Well, chronologically, the first one was Stephen, but
00:57:29
story-wise, the first one was Robert.
00:57:32
Speaker 6: Yes, stephen was the one that broke her.
00:57:33
Who popped her titty?
00:57:35
Speaker 4: Yeah, her breast, her breast.
00:57:37
Speaker 6: Yeah, no, that's total self-defense.
00:57:41
Speaker 1: No, say titty, casey or breast.
00:57:42
Speaker 4: Say titty.
00:57:51
Speaker 6: Say titty, say titty.
00:57:52
Her implant ruptured.
00:57:53
Yes.
00:57:53
Speaker 4: Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, her implant ruptured.
00:57:55
Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.
00:57:56
Speaker 6: Yes, she was just defending herself.
00:57:58
Obviously that's a legitimate story.
00:57:59
It's so unbelievable it's got to be believed.
00:58:01
Right, you know, unbelievable, it's gotta be believed.
00:58:04
Speaker 1: right, you know, and I'm sure the detectives will, oh
00:58:06
, vindicate her absolutely yeah, she'll get out yeah easily, I
00:58:08
mean it's a good defense I can see where her lot like, where
00:58:13
the logic yeah where the logic was there well, see, I had to.
00:58:16
Speaker 4: I cost nine thousand dollars.
00:58:17
Speaker 1: That's my property well, yeah, I mean in both cases
00:58:20
.
00:58:20
You know, she saw one guy getting eaten alive by pigs.
00:58:22
I'm I want to put him out of his misery.
00:58:24
She's like you know what?
00:58:24
I'm just going to put him out of his fucking memory, his
00:58:27
misery, you know.
00:58:28
Speaker 4: I can just see her sitting there, the detective,
00:58:31
just coming up with excuses With shit in her pants.
00:58:33
Speaker 7: I shit in my pants.
00:58:34
I shit in my pants.
00:58:38
I shit in my pants.
00:58:39
Speaker 4: Wait, why also did Steven get shot in the back of
00:58:43
the head, right?
00:58:44
Speaker 1: yeah, if you were wrestling with him in your
00:58:47
self-defense you got shot in the back of the head.
00:58:50
Well, the first shot was for the ruptured titty, yeah, and
00:58:53
the other one was because her fucking nipples are probably
00:58:54
still fucking sore.
00:58:55
Speaker 4: Yeah, she got, like you know, that secondary anger
00:58:57
Right.
00:58:58
Speaker 7: God damn it.
00:59:00
Speaker 4: All right, we can't distract distracted here.
00:59:02
Speaker 1: So Susan's stories.
00:59:03
They keep changing, and while she initially claimed that she
00:59:06
had shot Delacino in self-defense, she later claimed
00:59:10
he repeatedly shot himself in the head.
00:59:12
Oh, okay, yes.
00:59:14
Speaker 4: Yeah, so now we're just changing the story Right,
00:59:16
kind of like the Clintons.
00:59:17
Stop, stop, stop.
00:59:18
We're not Stop it, stop it.
00:59:20
We're getting on teeter-tottering.
00:59:23
We got transgender, we got Clinton.
00:59:26
Speaker 6: I did not have sex relations with that woman.
00:59:29
Damn your bill's real good.
00:59:32
Speaker 4: Wait what I said, his Bill Clinton's very good.
00:59:34
Yeah, that was pretty good yeah .
00:59:36
Speaker 1: All right, and none of her stories matched forensic
00:59:39
evidence collected at the scene.
00:59:45
Speaker 7: Now during her videotaped interrogation, when
00:59:46
she had shit in her pants monica had stated, I do not value
00:59:50
human life very much.
00:59:51
Speaker 1: The only thing wrong with this planet is there's
00:59:54
people on it.
00:59:54
If it weren't for us, all the other animals dodo, birds and
00:59:59
whatever else would still be here.
01:00:00
Oh, she does make a point not true, but okay the dodo birds
01:00:06
just died because they couldn't fucking fly.
01:00:08
They couldn't escape the humans .
01:00:11
Speaker 6: Their fault, not ours I mean I'm sure there were
01:00:16
animals that went extinct because of you know, before
01:00:19
humans were here.
01:00:20
Like, yeah, like all the dinosaurs and right if you
01:00:23
believe in that kind of stuff.
01:00:25
Speaker 4: Yeah, if if you believe in that kind of, so
01:00:29
that's hilarious see we would be having so much fun in another
01:00:32
type of podcast right now.
01:00:34
Speaker 1: Susan monica was charged with killing robert
01:00:36
haney in september of 2013 and stephen delacino in august of
01:00:40
2012.
01:00:41
She first appeared appeared in court video on Tuesday, january
01:00:45
24, 2014.
01:00:47
She attempted to fire her defense attorneys, but the judge
01:00:50
denied her request.
01:00:51
Susan told Jackson County Judge Timothy Barnack that her
01:00:55
attorneys are not properly investigating her defense.
01:00:59
Monica complained that one of the attorneys, christine Herbert
01:01:03
, architect.
01:01:06
Architect Herbert complained that one of the attorney
01:01:08
attorneys christine herbert architect wanted her to sign a
01:01:11
waiver to look at any mental health records that might exist
01:01:14
on it.
01:01:14
She seems to be more interested in my mental health than in
01:01:18
this case I mean, it's a fair defense.
01:01:20
Speaker 4: She knows you're fucked regardless like she's
01:01:22
trying to help you out a little bit, right.
01:01:24
Yeah, oh, that's funny.
01:01:26
You're kind of crazy, yeah, you're.
01:01:28
Speaker 1: Uh.
01:01:28
Barnack declined to fire herbert and code defense
01:01:31
attorney zachary light.
01:01:32
The judge also wouldn't let monica represent herself on to
01:01:35
murder or felony abuse.
01:01:37
Speaker 6: Imagine that show, imagine her representing herself
01:01:41
oh, that would have been.
01:01:42
Speaker 4: That's.
01:01:42
That would have been great right, especially if they
01:01:45
allowed TVs in the courtroom.
01:01:46
Speaker 1: That, would have been hilarious.
01:01:47
Speaker 4: Well, you see what happened.
01:01:50
Speaker 7: It was self-defense, my tit almost got ripped off.
01:01:52
He gave me a titty twister $9, your honor $9.
01:01:56
Speaker 1: That was a $9 titty twister.
01:01:59
It pissed me off, so I put a bullet in his fucking head, in
01:02:04
the back of his head, in the back of his head, yeah all right
01:02:09
, so yeah, so the judge wouldn't let monica represent herself on
01:02:12
two murder charges and two uh, felony, abusive corpse charges,
01:02:17
um, as she had requested wait, do you get charged if you feed
01:02:23
the corpse to the pigs?
01:02:25
Speaker 4: Abusive corpse.
01:02:25
That would be abusive corpse.
01:02:26
That's an extra card.
01:02:27
Oh, okay.
01:02:28
Speaker 1: Good to know.
01:02:28
Anything other than doing a proper disposal of a corpse is
01:02:37
abusive corpse.
01:02:38
Oh, okay, Didn't know that.
01:02:40
I'll give you an opportunity to represent yourself down the
01:02:43
line.
01:02:43
I'll give you an opportunity to represent yourself down the
01:02:44
line, but for now the judge said it would be a mistake not to
01:02:48
let them work the case right now .
01:02:51
Speaker 4: The judge is probably like listen, you're going to
01:02:53
jail anyway.
01:02:53
At least she's trying to help you out.
01:02:58
Speaker 1: He's like I'm not.
01:02:58
We're not dealing with a fucking mistrial here Now.
01:03:00
Barnack told Monica that you're normal to me and reminded her
01:03:03
that she is innocent until proven guilty.
01:03:05
I realize I am guilty of a couple things, but I am not
01:03:09
guilty of murder susan monica's headset.
01:03:11
The rambling 17 minute hearing was prompted by a letter monica
01:03:17
wrote to barnack that he said contained information about the
01:03:21
case.
01:03:21
In april 2015, the the trial began.
01:03:24
Susan Monica pled not guilty to two counts of murder, abuse of
01:03:28
a corpse and identity theft, which we know.
01:03:31
This is how the case originally fucking started.
01:03:34
Speaker 4: The Oregon Trail Electronic debit card.
01:03:39
Speaker 1: The trial lasted six days and definitely had its
01:03:41
circus moments, Susan.
01:03:43
She wore a number of different wigs and definitely was animated
01:03:47
and dramatic during the proceedings god, I'm gonna look
01:03:49
all this up when later on yeah, it's so wild.
01:03:53
Um, yeah, I was trying to get the video for all this, but, um,
01:03:58
I was having a problem recording it.
01:04:00
But yeah, it's fucking crazy.
01:04:02
Speaker 7: You gotta check it out now monica, despite having
01:04:03
represented uh representation, chose to cross-examine.
01:04:05
Speaker 1: But yeah, it's fucking crazy.
01:04:05
You gotta check it out now.
01:04:06
Monica, despite having representation, chose to cross
01:04:09
examine Eric Henderson, the case's lead investigator, and
01:04:13
during a trial, an Oregon State Police anthropologist testified
01:04:17
that Haney's legs had been dismembered with an axe and that
01:04:21
his thigh bones showed signs of being gnawed on by an animal.
01:04:25
So goes the story about the pig , right?
01:04:30
Yeah, now the anthropologist stated that it was unclear
01:04:34
whether haney had been dead prior to his dismemberment of
01:04:37
his legs.
01:04:38
It was also stated by the anthropologist that delacino had
01:04:41
suffered three to four gunshot wounds to the head.
01:04:44
God, that must have been a horrible titty twister.
01:04:49
Another witness who had been in jail with Monica testified that
01:04:52
she had received a birthday card from her, signed from the
01:04:55
sweetest murderer in Jackson County.
01:04:57
Oh how sweet, poor sweet.
01:05:00
Now Susan had addressed Haney's family, digging her heels in
01:05:03
about her story that she had discovered a disemboweled Haney
01:05:07
inexplicably in her pen, being devoured by pigs and near death
01:05:11
a month after he disappeared in the fall of 2013.
01:05:15
I couldn't bring myself to call you simply to say, hey, your
01:05:20
father has finally shown up.
01:05:21
Come get him out of my pig pen.
01:05:24
She said while seated in court.
01:05:25
She's like I just couldn't do it.
01:05:27
Closing arguments happen.
01:05:29
But then just one more scene.
01:05:32
Just before the jury was set to delivery, as Barnack addressed
01:05:35
the jury, monica stood up, raised her hand and began asking
01:05:39
for the chance to give jurors one more demonstration on how
01:05:43
she claimed she shot Tellocino with the gun held perpendicular
01:05:47
to the ground and in the air, the only way her story could
01:05:51
match forensic evidence.
01:05:53
Speaker 4: Yeah, because the best way to convince a jury that
01:05:57
you're innocent is to get up and act out how you shot someone
01:06:00
.
01:06:01
Speaker 1: Exactly how a forensic evidence fucking
01:06:03
demonstrated Great idea.
01:06:04
Monica blurted out I'd like to demonstrate how I shot him for
01:06:08
10 seconds.
01:06:09
That's all I need, 10 seconds.
01:06:10
And Judge Barnack at first ignored her.
01:06:13
Then Monica put her hands in the air, as she did in her
01:06:20
earlier testimony, from the stand and said I held the gun
01:06:22
like this Pretty animated right.
01:06:24
Yeah, how did it go?
01:06:25
Speaker 6: I'm in the line of fire, so yeah sorry, you're my
01:06:30
intended target.
01:06:31
Speaker 1: Yeah, muzzle discipline.
01:06:32
Yeah, yeah, finger up the trigger, please.
01:06:33
Uh, barnack ordered her back to the jackson county jail and
01:06:37
sheriff sheriff's deputies took her away.
01:06:39
She returned less than two hours later for the verdict.
01:06:41
The jury didn't buy monica's claim that she shot delacino
01:06:45
five times in the head in self-defense during a struggle
01:06:48
in her barn, or that she shot Haney to put him out of his
01:06:51
misery.
01:06:51
The so-called mercy defense is also not acknowledged under
01:06:57
Oregon Trail electronic card law .
01:06:59
It took the 10-man, two-woman jury about an hour to elect a
01:07:06
foreperson and reach its verdict of guilty on all charges.
01:07:10
Imagine sitting in on that jury verdict.
01:07:12
Speaker 4: They're like why did they take an hour?
01:07:14
Speaker 6: They probably just hung out for a little bit Like
01:07:16
we've got to make this look like we're actually going to do
01:07:18
something.
01:07:18
That's probably what it is.
01:07:19
Speaker 4: Like we can't just come right back in the room.
01:07:22
Speaker 1: Does anybody have dash pass?
01:07:23
We've got to go to lunch before we go back out there.
01:07:27
Somebody get the.
01:07:29
Speaker 5: Oregon Trail.
01:07:36
Speaker 3: Does dash pass?
01:07:36
Take the Oregon Trail.
01:07:37
Speaker 5: PBT card.
01:07:38
Speaker 3: We're going to get some pizzas.
01:07:42
Speaker 1: Yeah, they were like yeah, you can take your
01:07:45
shit-stained fucking pants and go fuck off.
01:07:47
Speaker 7: I shit in my pants.
01:07:49
Speaker 1: Now Judge Barnack.
01:07:50
He addressed Susan Monica.
01:07:51
He says you shot two people and fed them to you pigs.
01:07:55
I don't know how else I can put it that you value your pigs
01:07:58
more than you value people.
01:07:59
It may sound harsh, but you are a cold-blooded killer.
01:08:05
And Barnack sentenced Monica to two consecutive life terms with
01:08:10
a mandatory 25-year minimum on the murder charges.
01:08:13
She was given credit for time served in the Jackson City
01:08:17
County Jail and her remaining convictions.
01:08:19
Susan could have awaited sentencing, but asked for it to
01:08:23
be imposed as soon as the jury was dismissed, saying it doesn't
01:08:27
seem to matter, just fucking sentence me, I'm over it.
01:08:34
Speaker 4: Oh man what a story that's a good one.
01:08:37
Those are back-to-back fucking.
01:08:41
Speaker 6: I'd appeal that.
01:08:42
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'd appeal it as a defense attorney.
01:08:44
Speaker 4: how would you defend her?
01:08:45
See, this is what I like.
01:08:45
Appeal that, yeah.
01:08:45
Yeah, I'd appeal it.
01:08:45
Yeah.
01:08:45
How would you have as a defense attorney?
01:08:46
How would you defend her?
01:08:46
That's what see, this is what I like.
01:08:48
Speaker 6: This is what I like Casey for.
01:08:49
No, no, no, no.
01:08:49
I mean, obviously she's got something there.
01:08:53
You know, pigs are adorable there are some adorable pigs
01:08:57
there are and you know I wouldn't want to see anything
01:08:59
bad happen to Some adorable pigs .
01:09:02
Speaker 1: They're also bloodthirsty?
01:09:04
Are they, the pigs that wear the bow tie?
01:09:08
Speaker 6: I mean, I would imagine they get the little
01:09:09
squealies, Probably not.
01:09:10
Based on the description we've heard of her, it sounds like
01:09:14
they'd be well-kept pigs bow tie-wearing pigs.
01:09:20
Speaker 1: I like it.
01:09:21
I like it Okay.
01:09:23
Speaker 4: There's no defense.
01:09:23
You could actually be A defense attorney was looking for
01:09:26
anything.
01:09:27
Can I just please look?
01:09:28
Into your mental health yeah.
01:09:29
Speaker 6: Please.
01:09:29
There's probably a procedural error or something you know.
01:09:37
Speaker 1: Your Honor, I'd like to call to the stand a breast
01:09:39
implant titty twister specialist .
01:09:40
The amount?
01:09:40
Of pain that happens when you burst one of your implants from
01:09:42
a titty twister.
01:09:43
It can cause you extreme distress.
01:09:46
Speaker 4: God, I got it.
01:09:47
I'm 100%.
01:09:48
After this, I'm going to go Google.
01:09:51
You have to you have to.
01:09:52
Speaker 1: You have to look up all the interviews, you have to
01:09:54
look up the interrogation.
01:09:55
This is going to be a good one.
01:09:56
The best part is she's sitting there.
01:09:58
I'm not even kidding, this is the's sitting there.
01:10:06
She's sitting in a chair, okay, for like 20 minutes, and you
01:10:12
can see her kind of like shifting around.
01:10:14
Speaker 4: Oh, she's letting a little bit of gas out of the air
01:10:17
.
01:10:17
Speaker 1: The detective comes in into the interrogation room
01:10:21
and I don't know if it's because the camera is angled a certain
01:10:24
way, or he's doing it for a power struggle, or whatever.
01:10:27
He tells susan monica, I need you to sit in that chair.
01:10:29
And as soon as susan monica gets up out of the chair to move
01:10:33
to the other one, that's when she says that's a shit in my
01:10:36
pants and the detective not even phased, doesn't even look at
01:10:41
the chair to see if there's a fucking shit stain right back.
01:10:43
He sits right in the chair.
01:10:44
He's like fuck you.
01:10:46
Speaker 4: I don't care, dedication right there.
01:10:47
Speaker 1: I don't care, you sit down.
01:10:49
And she sat there another fucking hour with fucking shit
01:10:51
in her pants.
01:10:52
That was pretty fucking well.
01:10:55
Speaker 7: I shit my pants.
01:10:59
Speaker 4: That should be the name of the episode.
01:11:00
Speaker 6: Alright.
01:11:05
Speaker 1: Ladies and gentlemen, that'll do it for this episode
01:11:07
of criminal af.
01:11:08
You know you can let us know what you thought of this episode
01:11:11
by going to leave a comment on good pods or on spotify, or
01:11:15
leave us a review on apple podcast.
01:11:17
Thank you all so much for hanging out with us.
01:11:19
Now you can head on over to criminal as fuckcom to ask us
01:11:23
anything you'd like via our mail call tab or, if you'd like us
01:11:26
to give us some shitty advice, you know, like we do sometimes,
01:11:31
you can hit us up on our Dear Douchebags tab.
01:11:33
Now, signing off from Studio Chloroform, keep your head on a
01:11:37
swivel and stay safe till next time.
01:11:39
See ya, casey.
01:11:42
Speaker 4: you didn't say see ya , oh see ya Ready Three, two,
01:11:46
one, See ya Casey you didn't say see ya.
01:11:48
Speaker 1: Oh see ya, ready Three, two, one, see ya.
01:11:50
No-transcript.
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